Changing Oil Pan for better drain plug location

[tylerb43]

So I didn't really notice it while building or installing the engine, but the drain plug location is in a horrible spot, right above the cross member. My truck had an old 390 (non-original) that sat for decades, so I opted to start with a second 390 I had, which I was told came from a '73 Galaxie. I knew the fullsize cars and the 2wd trucks were both front sumps, and I didn't study it much further than that.

But after I got the engine onto the chassis, I realized the drain plug just won't work there. It's located on the passenger side, about 1" forward of the rear of the sump, facing outboard. Even if I could get the plug out, it would dump oil all over the crossmember - not cool.

In this picture you can also see the indented areas on the rear of the pan, these were to clear the car's steering linkage.



Kinda dark, but click on this to blow it up, and you can kinda see the issue.



So I went back to my old 390 that I had in the truck back in high school, and sure enough, it's drain plug was different. It's on the driver's side, at the rear corner of the sump, facing outboard and aft. Much better.



So I pulled the pan off the old motor and glass beaded it, and painted it up. As you can see it's part number is C7AE-6675A, with a date code of 08-10-72. I knew the old 390 was not original in my '69, which came with a 360.







I also ordered a Fumoto F-101N drain plug (with the nipple for attaching a short hose). Hopefully this will help solve any oil drain issues I would've had.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B003VC ... 00_details

Have any of you other guys ran into this?? Any performance differences with switching the pans? (I noticed they have different style baffles in them) I'm not building a race truck, so I doubt I'll care...

[1972hiboy]

I think you did the smart thing putting a truck pan back on there. If I remeber correctly the oil will still be over the cross member. Im hoping you put a couple pics up to show your fumoto valve all installed in the pan. DOnt think there is much differance performce wise regarding the baffles. the car pan was just probably altered a little bit to make it fit the best way in the car it was in and same for the truck pan.

[1972hiboy]

duplicate post

[Ranchero50]

Robroy had a short peice of pipe welded on so it would drain away from the crossmember.

[colnago]

I also understand that you can use a pan from an FT engine. This has a rear drain. Dunno if it has a front or rear sump, though; the pan looks pretty flat on the bottom to me.

Joseph

[basketcase0302]

My 360 that was in my truck was also the same way, (drain over and onto the crossmember) and worse!
The PO had actually stripped out the threads on the pan due to it being such a PIB to work with.
So what does any low budget redneck do-that will be yanking the engine out soon anyway...
JB Weld the plug into the pan, (so it will hold oil) and use a marine pump to change the oil.

Seems like I remember reading here the car pans were all front sump? Still doesn't answer the pan in my truck, as it really appeared to be the original engine when I yanked it out?

[tylerb43]

Thanks for the replies, guys.

Rich, I definitely will post some pics when I get the Fumoto valve installed, I can't wait to see it myself.

And Jeff, yes, car pans are front sump, as are the 2wd pans for our trucks, I guess my point was that just because they're both front sump doesn't make them form-fit-function identical, which is what it seems as you read through some of the posts about pans on this forum. And your engine may be original, but I guess it's possible that the pan could've been replace at some point because of damage or something?

Joseph - I've also heard that the FT pans will fit the engine, and I think some are called "full sump" (pretty flat on the bottom). However, on our trucks (2wd) you may have clearance issues to the steering linkage, especially at a full lock turn.

Do you guys know if there are different oil capacity pans (talking car and truck front-sumps only here). Is the truck pan I'm painting above a 5 qt? I'm planning on doing a side by side comparison with it and the Galaxie pan once I get it out, and maybe a volume test, just to satisfy my curiosity if nothing else.

[cdeal28078]

My 71 came with a 302 stock and I am pretty sure it was a front sump pan with the drain plug on the back side of the pan. It still made a mess of the cross member when draining the oil.
The 460 in it now came from a 76-77 F150 and is a front sump pan with the drain plug on the back side of the pan and still makes a mess. I saw a fold-able piece of plastic somewhere ether on TV or in the store that you can fold and put in place so the oil won't drain on the cross member. I need to get one for myself. Might be worth it for many of us to get one.
Clint

[tylerb43]

Hey guys, I got the quick drain valve and installed it on the replacement pan. I'll install the pan on the engine soon, just waiting on the new pan gasket. I have a feeling I'll get impatient and do a test fit install just to see how much clearance there is to the crossmember.

[colnago]

Ooh, yes! Keep us posted. I almost bought one of these valves, but didn't know if I would run into fitment issues. Definitely let us know.

Joseph

[robroy]

Good day TylerB43 and Jamie,

Jamie, thanks for mentioning my modification! Actually, now that I've actually used it a few times, it didn't practically work out as well as I'd hoped. That's because the pipe section I had welded on wasn't located at the true bottom of the pan. I tried doing the oil change on a hill once, but decided to never do that again because I felt too nervous about #50 rollin' over me!

TylerB43, I love the looks of that valve you found! Wow. I admit that my first thought's a little paranoia about a small tree branch or something pressing up against it and drainin' the oil at an inopportune time though. May I know how stiff that lever is? Anything special preventing it from being pressed on by debris under the truck? I guess that's an unlikely scenario, but hey it's the oil.

Robroy

[mrollings53]

From the picture it looks like you have to pull the lever down and then turn it to open the valve. Looks like there is also a spring on the lever, which I think would apply pressure to keep it seated in the closed position.

IMG_2137.jpg

[mjhaltom]

Nice fix! But you realize you are giving up the free rust preventative coating for your front crossmember that would be reapplied at ever oil change!

[tylerb43]

From the picture it looks like you have to pull the lever down and then turn it to open the valve. Looks like there is also a spring on the lever, which I think would apply pressure to keep it seated in the closed position.

IMG_2137.jpg

That's exactly right, mrollings53! Opening the valve is a two-part movement. One - lift the lever up away from the valve, and Two - turn to open just as you say. In the picture of the valve in my hand above, the valve is open and you can see the spring compressed. The little lever is pretty hard to turn, it kinda hurts your finger tip to do it.

I'm a 'what if' guy too, Robroy. I'm an engineer and it's in my nature to think about what "could" happen, and then design to prevent it. If you had this valve in your hand, the scenario of the valve opening on it's own becomes Highly unlikely, and nearly impossible.

Nice fix! But you realize you are giving up the free rust preventative coating for your front crossmember that would be reapplied at ever oil change!

HA! Good one, I guess you're right, that may be a downside to this fix, depending on how you look at it, but it's something I'm willing to do without

[tylerb43]

Hey guys, I got the replacement pan with valve installed yesterday. It's going to work out great. You could either attach a short piece of hose every time you change the oil. Or just leave the hose on there all the time, which is what I believe I'm going to do. Check it out.

Before I started, I used my Mity-vac fluid extractor to suck all the oil out of the pan so I didn't have to use the drain plug and make the huge mess I'm trying to prevent with this fix.

Getting the 390 up in the air. (I removed both engine mount nuts and the single trans mount bolt (C6))


View from the underside. (cleaning the gasket surface) ooh - I need to paint those crank pulley bolt heads!


And here are a couple to show clearance to the valve.
From the aft side looking forward.


Looking aft and slightly inboard.


I did notice that with the engine set back down on the mounts, I didn't have clearance to the crossmember to remove and reinstall the valve, so if you have this same pan, and want to install this valve, you would have to raise the engine a little to screw in the valve (only like a 1/4"-1/2" or so). You may be able to unbolt the left side mount only, and lift that side of the engine...it doesn't need much at all.

Here's to clean oil changes!!!